I don’t think a slight delay would hurt this game. I don’t think it’s a good situation for both Microsoft and Arkane when I have friends that aren’t enthusiast showing me the tweet that it’s 30fps.
A major issue with patching 60fps later is many might not care that much for game in a couple of weeks after launch, so I don’t think they’re doing themselves any favours.
Anyways, this game will be a real test to see if framerates matter and we can gauge things via xbox engagement and see where it lands and most played and whatnot. I might be wrong, but I don’t think launching a shooter like this at 30fps is wise and it would’ve been better to delay until they have things working properly. I know the game isn’t as big as Halo, but Halo releasing half baked did more damage than good
I don’t think a single tweet of thiers has anywhere near that level of engagement, kinda telling where all this is coming from haha.
You know what, this could be a smart way to delay it with a reason. If they delayed it before this and said they need more time people will go on about oh another delay the game sucks, but if they delay it now, in theory people should be happy they’re listening to feedback and “fixing” it.
Like i’ve said on the other thread, the bad news tweet had the same engagement as the entire account previous tweets. This game was targeted to be deliberately hated.
lol all these conspiracy theories about redfall’s development, when the real explanation is that this is the first game that they have made like this so of course they’re gonna find out what works and what doesnt ad hoc.
I’ll be completely honest. I haven’t read too much of the last several hundred posts. But I’m still going to throw in my two cents on the Redfall controversy.
As many of you know, I am one of the more “experienced” members of the forum. I’ve been gaming since Pong. I’ll be 56 years old next month. So, I may be able to offer a tiny bit of wisdom or perspective on the situation.
Gaming is my favorite hobby, with following gaming news (and coming to this forum) being a close second. The purpose of these hobbies is to bring joy to my life and to distract me from the stress, sadness, and other “negatives” that real life frequently throws at us. For me, there is no point in engaging in the hobby in a way that will magnify my stress, create anger, etc. That would be completely counter-productive (for me).
I have enough stress from real life - I don’t need my hobbies to create more. Just to give you a few examples:
My father passed away in January. I am now helping my mother adjust to being a widow.
Within the next two weeks I will probably have to lay off 25% of my team at work.
Since the team’s workload will not go down at all, I have to somehow convince the remaining part of the team to pick up all the extra work created by the layoffs.
Given the above, Redfall not releasing with a 60 FPS mode does not even hit a 1 out of 10 on my disappointment meter. That is not to say it’s not disappointing, it just doesn’t come close to the level to trigger any rage, sadness, etc from me. Those emotions are reserved for real life events.
I will probably spend the time waiting for Redfall’s 60 fps mode playing a completely different game. I still haven’t finished Hi-Fi Rush, Wo Long, Persona 3, and about 500 other games in my backlog. I will find something great to distract me and bring me joy while I wait to play Redfall.
Please understand, I’m not trying to tell anyone else how they should approach their hobby or what emotions they should feel about Redfall or anything else. I’m simply telling you what works for me.
Of course. It’s releasing in the midst of a massive console war in which militant PS fanboys are trashing everything Xbox related but especially Redfall since it was also scheduled for release on the PS5 during its early development (until Microsoft bought Bethesda). It’s no surprise it’s getting dislikes completely unrelated to the quality of its showings so far.
Hence why it’s so unbelievable they’ve scored this own goal by releasing it at 30 fps. I was on board day one on Game Pass until they dropped this clanger.
Just try something like Ghostwire Tokyo in its so called “quality mode” (lol at that oxymoron) & see what a modern day first person video game with HDR looks like in motion at 30 fps. It’s no exaggeration to say it’s a pretty bad experience.
Forza Horizon has traditionally seen the best 30 fps implementation on the market. Digital Foundry even noted this in their Forza Horizon 5 tech review. Games like Red Dead Redemption 2 also have a very playable 30 fps as well. But there’s reasons why in both cases; with Forza having a very effective motion blur & Red Dead being very slow & deliberate with the main character animation.
But Redfall is a first person game. This makes the player pan the camera faster during gunfights & the limitations of 30 fps become apparent very quickly. Now with Redfall it could be slightly mitigated if the visuals are clean & movement is smooth without being too fast paced, i.e. because high density geometry & high contrast HDR exacerbate the bad feeling of a lower framerate in an action game as well. Could this be the case? From what we’ve seen of the game it’s hard to tell. But with it being in first person the chances are ‘no’.
The bottom line is 30 fps generally needs to have any or a combination of the following to at least make it playable: slow movement, a distant camera, fantastic object + camera motion blur & clean image quality without too much contrast.
But players can go & test Ghostwire Tokyo’s 30 fps quality mode right now to see whether Redfall will at least be ‘playable’ for them. For me, it most likely won’t be. My TV is too big, the HDR is too bright & the geometry is too detailed in these games. I can’t pan the camera in a 30 fps first person game for more than 10, 15 minutes before I start to get a headache.
i would really like for Xbox to reduce the number of bad news days.
And this all on UE4, didn’t expect that.
reminds me of Scalebound tbh. Nobody gave a shit about that game bevore it was cancelled. And now the 30fps news has 1000+ posts on some other forum, lol.
Yeah this exactly. The ‘Xbox can’t make good games and this is proof’ is fanboyism to the max. It’s complete nonsense.
But the issue is that Arkane should not be releasing a UE4 FPS game at 30FPS on console. In 2023. They just should not. The fact they’ve obviously tried to hide this speaks volumes.
This 1 million % and I hate that some people will just consider what you said as damage control or just defending a corporation, when it’s all just about having perspective. I do think we all sometimes get into it a bit much and as much as I would love 60fps at launch for every single game that ever releases, it’s not that big of a deal for me. I also understand it is a big deal for others and can understand why they’re upset, it’s good they’re adding a 60 mode after launch and it might be best to just wait for that.
Sorry for your loss and stress at work, I can fully understand why this is such thing for you.
Reading this thread today I thought I’d stumbled onto the other era by mistake as there is so much projecting and doom posting based of a few lines of text.
Maybe be just wait and see how it plays before killing the game?
Nonsensical to call for a delay to a game because your preferred mode is not available at launch. All those who don’t care about 60fps should not be able to play until you can at 60? Why?
You guys can just wait 'til the patch and fill the time with a play through of Zelda Tears, oh hang on that won’t have a 60fps mode either so that lives in the bin as well.
Telling the Xbox hierarchy “30 fps is fine in a first person shooter” sends the wrong message & absolutely will hurt the brand. No question in my mind. They need to know this isn’t normal & cannot be a trend going forwards. Otherwise why did I buy a Series X? It certainly wasn’t to play at 30 fps anymore.
You can’t play the “entitled gamers” card when we’re talking about a 12tf 500 euro console getting an inarguably bad framerate with Redfall.
I find it sad when conversations cannot be had in a rational manner & we end up with valid complaints being handwaved as ‘doom posting’ or something. I mean this is no joke, my Game Pass sub was only on auto renewal for May because of Redfall. Did it look like the best game ever? No, but considering all the comparisons with Far Cry (which runs at 60 fps for what it’s worth) & other such games, I figured I’d have some fun. Now I know I won’t on release day at least, i.e. I know this because the simple aforementioned test of trying Ghostwire Tokyo in its 30 fps mode says all I need to know about how unenjoyable Redfall will be at 30 fps as well.
This is not “doom”, I’m simply saying this as a customer of Xbox.
It’s not though is it, 60fps is on the way not off the table. You are saying that because that’s the only mode you’ll play the game should not release until it’s there. i.e. everyone who doesn’t care must wait so you can play day 1. if that isn’t entitled behaviour I don’t know what else it is.
Spending 500 euro on a console doesn’t entitle you to all games at 60fps, buying the latest console generation never has. If you want to guarantee yourself that then you are going to need to spend considerably more on a high end PC.
The conversation is perfectly rational, what isn’t is your expectation that all Xbox first party games must release to your exact expectations to pass some kind of imaginary quality goal or be delayed until they do when the reality is that a large number (maybe even the majority) won’t have the same expectations and it won’t effect their enjoyment at all.
At the end of the day we’re all Xbox players here and ever since these acquisitions started we’ve been hoping it could go back to the glory days of 360. We all want the best.
Things have been looking very promising, but the wait also has been very long. Delays, promises made that never happened and 2023 was supposed to be the year of Forza, Redfall, Minecraft and Starfield. Not counting surprise releases such as HFR. Which obviously is great.
But then the news that Redfall basically still isn’t 100% ready is just disappointing and I think most of the reactions (except overreactions, or Sony boys spewing nonsense, who cares about that anyway?) are understandable and level headed.
It never was my most anticipated game this year, Starfield is and I just hope that one IS ready, for Xbox Series X. It’s all I ask.
Clarity and transparancy go a long way, all this bad press kinda could have gotten avoided.
60 fps is not subjectively better, it’s simply better.
What the 30 fps defenders are saying is (I’ll paraphrase) “we’re fine with a subpar experience, don’t spoil our hype & fun with negativity”.
If you want Xbox to do well (which I do… because I invest real time & money into the brand), you should want 60 fps in first person first party games.
Being “entitled” has got absolutely nothing to do with anything, in fact such a label is quite pernicious because I am actually entitled to the next gen experience I was promised when I bought the console, i.e. ‘most powerful Xbox ever’ which I didn’t expect to serve me up Redfall at 30 fps. But it’s not the console’s fault. The hardware is absolutely fantastic. Arkane are the one’s who’ve made a mistake here by prioritising resolution over framerate in a first person shooter.
It’s not going back to the 360 days until they start acting likes it’s the 360 days. So yes that means turning into green Sony sometimes. Because that’s effectively what 360 was, it was green Sony.
The plan is to fill Game Pass with first party titles.
The problem is these games aren’t releasing fast enough & they aren’t releasing in good condition either. It means the big push to keep people subscribed to Game Pass is a bit difficult right now. Xbox needed a win & the sad part is that’s really only going to come from the CMA & EU with their Activision ruling in the coming weeks, not from Redfall. The good news with Activision is they’re technically competent & have a massive library of game releases which can be dropped into Game Pass as soon as the deal passes (insofar as they’re contractually able to).
I also see a lot of people being skeptical about this “at a later date” and I get that too, I’m the same. It’s a little like Halo with how co-op and forge weren’t ready, obviously those two take a whole lot more time. Is it a few weeks, is it more than a month? Well, nothing we can do about it.
Some here speculated that maybe they have it running in 60fps on XSX, just not 100% yet and they want to make sure it is before they add it. I hope that’s the case, but after what Colt said I’m not too sure. Hopefully his concern turns out to be nothing.
Such a weird decision, releasing it only at 30 FPS, i thought by all these different modes GoW and Hogwarts had, that it didn’t require too much work? Even more for a game that doesn’t look great technically and it’s running on UE4. I would “understand” this for a slower paced game, just not for an FPS.
I wouldn’t discard that due to the backlash, they put extra resources on having it ready for day 1, i hope so.
I think after Activision it’s time for MS to either just focus on hiring more employees for their owned studios or just hire/fund some support studios like the ones Sony has
