Games Analysis |OT| Time To Argue About Pixels And Frames!

[GavinStevens]

@Resist

No one in these threads said it was “free”.

Ya’ll gotta stop trying to downplay a hardware feature just because it isn’t in one console.

Is that honestly what you think I did? Ok.

[Resist]

@TavishHill

He isn’t trying to downplay it. He is just saying it, like everything else, has a cost associated with using it.

And we (the dozen or so regular posters in this thread) are perfectly aware of it. In fact, posts above his bring that up. Not saying he isn’t knowledgeable or doesn’t have anything worthwhile to contribute, but “VRS worsens image quality for gains in performance” isn’t particularly enlightening.

[TavishHill]

@Resist

And we (the dozen or so regular posters in this thread) are perfectly aware of it. In fact, posts above his bring that up. Not saying he isn’t knowledgeable or doesn’t have anything worthwhile to contribute, but “VRS worsens image quality for gains in performance” isn’t particularly enlightening.

He didn’t say that afaik. He just explained how it worked since some here in the thread do not seem to understand it.

[GavinStevens]

I said VRS lowers precision in situations where you don’t actually notice that precision being lost. Doom isn’t quite right and it could be pushed further to increase quality, but even then, you have to zoom in 400% to even notice it.

A little hostile there chap.

[Kals_Els]

@GavinStevens

Yeah I’ve got mega eyes on that event, gonna be very interesting. Coalition are the bee’s knees with UE, absolute masters of it. So what we see should be something special.

BUT… I fear it will be more… Lets say “attainable” visuals, and not fancy tech stuff that will never fully be utilised. In other words what they show could very well be perfectly possible ingame visuals, and as such they may get roasted by certain people because its not utterly bonkers.

Maybe, but looking at Forza Horizon 5 and knowing that’s attainable fills me with a lot optimism.

[GavinStevens]

@Kals_Els

Maybe, but looking at Forza Horizon 5 and knowing that’s attainable fills me with a lot optimism.

Yeah Forza tech is incredible. I can’t wait to see what they do with Fable.

[GavinStevens]

FWIW: I did a small talk about VRS here. Feel free to join the discussion.

Gavin Stevens

[FindTheGamer]

PS5 vs Xbox Series X 120fps Comparison (Fortnite, Black Ops Cold War & More) - YouTube

timestamp: 5:41

Does anyone know about this or can explain better? Vincent shows that the latency is much lower for xbox series x than the PS5 because even when you switch to graphics mode, the console is still running at the full output of 4k 120fps leading to lower latency.

[GavinStevens]

It boils down to the fact 120hz on a tv has less input lag, so what they are doing is rendering at 60 and doubling the frame so that it fits in a 120hz output. It’s still 60, but you get the reduced input lag of 120.

Ratchet did the same sort of idea with their 40fps patch for 120hz displays.

[FindTheGamer]

@GavinStevens

It boils down to the fact 120hz on a tv has less input lag, so what they are doing is rendering at 60 and doubling the frame so that it fits in a 120hrz output. It’s still 60, but you get the reduced input lag of 120.

Ratchet did the same sort of idea with their 40fps patch for 120hrz displays.

isnt that like alot less latency than 60fps, like end to end. Does this apply to every game?

[GavinStevens]

@FindTheGamer

isnt that like alot less latency than 60fps, like end to end. Does this apply to every game?

It should be less latency but same performance. And it needs to be added on a per game basis sadly, it’s not automatic.

[Staffy]

I didn’t watch any of the Doom videos yet, but that picture that was posted a few hours ago does show a difference. But going by all the comments here it’s clear XSX has the advantage. I assume the picture is fake then?

I find this tech stuff all very interesting, but it absolutely isn’t my forte.

[SpiderLink]

@Staffy

I didn’t watch any of the Doom videos yet, but that picture that was posted a few hours ago does show a difference. But going by all the comments here it’s clear XSX has the advantage. I assume the picture is fake then?

I find this tech stuff all very interesting, but it absolutely isn’t my forte.

The photo of the rubble with fluid running down it? I didn’t watch the video and I’m not well-versed in the tech but my understanding is that the Series X version looks a bit blurrier than the PS5 version because of VRS.

In this instance, it’s trading off some background clarity for better resolution. Since the difference is only visible on some scenery that isn’t the focus of the scene and at a 400% zoom, it seems like a good exchange to me.

Edit: Please correct any mistakes I made, people who actually know things!

[FindTheGamer]

@Staffy

I didn’t watch any of the Doom videos yet, but that picture that was posted a few hours ago does show a difference. But going by all the comments here it’s clear XSX has the advantage. I assume the picture is fake then?

I find this tech stuff all very interesting, but it absolutely isn’t my forte.

All you need to know it’s higher rez and crisper on the xsx on your large 4k tvs

[TavishHill]

@Staffy

I didn’t watch any of the Doom videos yet, but that picture that was posted a few hours ago does show a difference. But going by all the comments here it’s clear XSX has the advantage. I assume the picture is fake then?

I find this tech stuff all very interesting, but it absolutely isn’t my forte.

VRS hw in the XSX version allows devs to shift pixels around the screen to pack more detail in some areas at the cost of less detail in others. It does this on a frame by frame basis. Alternatively, it can ignore shading some pixels in low-detail areas and get a performance gain in fps. What you are likely referring to is the image of some water dribbling down a slope from the F vid on the RT implementation. There, the VRS in XSX version is reducing detail in that area, which is an area that the player is unlikely to have their eyes focus on on-screen.

[Staffy]

@SpiderLink

The photo of the rubble with fluid running down it? I didn’t watch the video and I’m not well-versed in the tech but my understanding is that the Series X version looks a bit blurrier than the PS5 version because of VRS.

In this instance, it’s trading off some background clarity for better resolution. Since the difference is only visible on some scenery that isn’t the focus of the scene and at a 400% zoom, it seems like a good exchange to me.

Edit: Please correct any mistakes I made, people who actually know things!

In that case it’s definitely a good trade off. Nobody should be worried about stuff that isn’t even in focus.

@FindTheGamer

All you need to know it’s higher rez and crisper on the xsx on your large 4k tvs

When it all comes down to it that’s all that matters. But I was just curious about that picture. Now I know.

[No-1HoloLens-Fan]

This OT felt alive today

Love all of you guys

Keep discussing tech - frames and Full RDNA2

[Senua]

@SpiderLink

Series X version looks a bit blurrier than the PS5

When you zoom 400% in background.

[BRiT]

@Senua

When you zoom 400% in background.

And keep it static. This is entirely focusing on small portions of the screen that are shown for all of 1/60th of a second or 1/120th of a second [16.6 milliseconds or 8.3 milliseconds].

That’s definitely not how action shooter games are to be played. Simply watching “Coffee with Cabesa” episodes featuring Doom Eternal will highlight this. The moment you stop moving you’re dead. You’re not even looking in the same general direction for more than 5 seconds at a time.

[javycane]

@BRiT

And keep it static. This is entirely focusing on small portions of the screen that are shown for all of 1/60th of a second or 1/120th of a second [16.6 milliseconds or 8.3 milliseconds].

That’s definitely not how action shooter games are to be played. Simply watching “Coffee with Cabesa” episodes featuring Doom Eternal will highlight this. The moment you stop moving you’re dead. You’re not even looking in the same general direction for more than 5 seconds at a time.

Doom and Wolfenstein (to a lesser extent) are games that you absolutely have to keep moving at all times lmao.